LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

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DocZaius
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by DocZaius »

Tonight on Lost

The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham: [spoiler]Locke's mission off the island as Jeremy is revealed. [/spoiler]  Okay, so that's not much of a spoiler.  Maybe I should hang myself. :ninja:

Previously on Lost

316:  Eloise Hawking escorts Jack, Ben, Desmond and Sun into the Lamp Post, a DHARMA Initiative station located underneath the church. The station was built atop a pocket of unique electromagnetic energy which is connected to other such pockets across the world, including the island. The island moves through time in a seemingly random manner, but the designer of the station created an equation to determine where the island would be in a precise window of time; the window for the Oceanic 6 closes in only 36 hours. Desmond delivers his message from Faraday to Hawking, but Hawking informs him that the island isn't finished with him. Desmond flips out and leaves. Hawking tells Jack that the O6 need to be on Ajira 316 as that flight will take them over the island. But they also need to recreate as best they can the circumstances that brought them to the island in the first place, which includes bringing as many as the same people as they can. Failure to do so will result in unpredictable consequences. Locke killed himself to act as a proxy for Christian Shephard, but will need something of Christian's. Jack talks with Ben and learns Ben has unfinished business to attend to. Jack meets his grandfather and gets a pair of his father's shoes from him. Returning home, he finds a very upset Kate laying in his bed. She agrees to accompany him back to the island, but refuses to tell him what happened and makes him promise never to ask about Aaron. The next morning, a bruised and bloodied Ben phones Jack and tells him he's been "sidetracked" and Jack will need to retrieve Locke's body. He does so, putting Christian's shoes on Locke and then takes the body to the airport. He meets up with Sun and the two see Sayid being escorted by a Federal marshal. Jack then discovers Hurley has also shown up and has booked all the stand-by seats. Hurley appears to have been coerced to show up, dodging Jack's questions as to how he found out about Ajira 316. The five board the plane and Ben, arm in a sling, makes it aboard before they push off; Hurley freaks out that Ben is there. Ajira 316 takes off and Jack notices the captain sounds familiar; it's Frank Lapidus. Frank notices Jack and company are aboard and realizes they're not going to be landing in Guam. Later in the flight, Jack reads Locke's suicide note: "I Wished you had believed me." The aircraft hits turblence, a time displacement occurs and Jack finds himself in the jungle on the island. He finds Hurley and Kate, and the trio are met by a DHARMA bus driven by Jin in a DHARMA jumpsuit.

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Last edited by DocZaius on Wed Jul 24, 2013 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
G8rMom7
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by G8rMom7 »

I have to say I'm not all that thrilled about tonights episode...not a huge Locke fan...but eh, I'll still watch it of course.
Okay, let's try this!

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DocZaius
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by DocZaius »

I liked the first two seasons, when Locke was all badass.

Then he turned into a half-wit. He has no clue what's going on.
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efbart
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by efbart »

We started watching this right after nucklehead was born...the Sci Fi replays. Then four at a time wasn't enough so, we started renting them...now we're caught up and having to wait a week between episodes...SUCKS!

John was indeed a lot easier to take when he was single-minded and less confused.
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G8rMom7
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by G8rMom7 »

^^^Yay, we have someone else in our little Lost crowd...does it hurt your head as much as it does mine?
Okay, let's try this!

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a1bion
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Post by a1bion »

How weird is it that I have only a handful of tv shows I still try to watch on a regular basis and the alumni of one of my all time favorite shows, The Wire, now keep showing up on them?

The Office already has Amy Ryan, who previously played Officer Beadie Russell on The Wire, playing an HR rep for whom Michael has a thing. Reportedly, they're also going to be bringing on Idris Elba, who played mega-badass Stringer Bell on The Wire, to play a rival regional manager to Michael. Surely, he will make good use of his knowledge of microeconomics to go after Michael (you have to be a fan of The Wire to get that one).

Now Lost has added Lance Reddick, who played Lt. Cedric Daniels on The Wire, to be Locke's "driver." Awesome!
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G8rMom7
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by G8rMom7 »

Well Lance has been on Lost for a while...he was on at least last season and I believe has shown up on other seasons as well.

The show tonight was what I expected although I am just annoyed that you really get no answers. I know, I know...surprise surprise.
Okay, let's try this!

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efbart
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by efbart »

I thought there was some wasted space lastnight.
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DocZaius
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by DocZaius »

Last night was kind of a "filler" episode. We didn't learn too much that we didn't already know.

Things we did learn:

[spoiler]1. Locke's alive - not really surprising.
2. Ben killed Locke - kind of surprising, seeing as how we all thought Locke committed suicide.
3. Widmore might not be the bad guy we thought he was, but I suspect that both Widmore and Ben Linus are bad guys and that neither should be trusted.
4. Ben didn't know how to get back to the island until Locke told him to find Eloise Hawking.[/spoiler]

Questions:

[spoiler]1. Where are Sun and Sayid?
2. What woman did Lapidus run off with? Sun? If it was Sun, why didn't she disappear like Jack, Hurley and Kate (and probably Sayid) did?
3. It appears as though the Ajira 316 survivors are on the little island. But WHEN? When Sawyer, et al. were jumping through time they found the Ajira bottle in the canoes on the main island in the near future. But now it appears as though they are in the 1970s - and so are Jack, Kate and Hurley.[/spoiler]
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G8rMom7
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Post by G8rMom7 »

My comments are bolded in the spoiler...
Last night was kind of a "filler" episode. We didn't learn too much that we didn't already know.

Things we did learn:

[spoiler]1. Locke's alive - not really surprising. I think it's surprising in that he came back from the dead. I knew they'd bring him back but I wasn't sure how they would explain. I guess it's a time travel thing which seems to be the way they explain everything now
2. Ben killed Locke - kind of surprising, seeing as how we all thought Locke committed suicide. That was surprising to me because I had come to believe Ben was a good guy. Guess I was wrong
3. Widmore might not be the bad guy we thought he was, but I suspect that both Widmore and Ben Linus are bad guys and that neither should be trusted. TOTALLY agree with this one.
4. Ben didn't know how to get back to the island until Locke told him to find Eloise Hawking. And Eloise is not a Ben fan either so I'm starting to wonder what Ben's motives are exactly.[/spoiler]

Questions:

[spoiler]1. Where are Sun and Sayid? I think it must have been Sun that took off with Sayid in the boat and I'm sure they were heading to the main island. I believe the Ajira 316 flight crashed on the other island...you know the one where the sub was, etc. That is why John was looking at the other island while he was talking...he needed to get over there.
2. What woman did Lapidus run off with? Sun? If it was Sun, why didn't she disappear like Jack, Hurley and Kate (and probably Sayid) did? Don't know.
3. It appears as though the Ajira 316 survivors are on the little island. But WHEN? When Sawyer, et al. were jumping through time they found the Ajira bottle in the canoes on the main island in the near future. But now it appears as though they are in the 1970s - and so are Jack, Kate and Hurley. Yeah, this part hurts my head. [/spoiler]
Okay, let's try this!

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efbart
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Post by efbart »

How do I do the spoiler thing?

I'm a moron with this stuff.
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G8rMom7
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Post by G8rMom7 »

To read the spoiler just click on the button in the post. To add a spoiler, go to the "reply" section (not quick reply unless you write what you want and THEN hit preview...you'll then be in the full reply section). Write what you want, then highlight it. One of the symbols above the text box looks like one of those warning symbols you see on a nuclear reactor (yellow and black). Click on that and it will add a spoiler button so when you hit preview you'll see.
Okay, let's try this!

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efbart
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Post by efbart »

I think I've figured it out...it's the icon that says spoiler.


[spoiler]It might not be the time travel mom. Jack's Daddy got there in a coffin too....before the time shifts.

The scene of Ben killing John shocked me...in a BOO sort of way, but not the act. One of two things, I think...Ben needed further information from John and he needed to make sure that John "died," as part of the plan to get back to the island and stop the shifts. John hasn't been able to kill anybody else...would he have been able to go through with it. OR, Ben needed the information from John and he wants John dead...real dead, eliminated as a challenger...it isn't the first time he's tried to kill him.

I think the personal war that's being waged between Widmore and Ben has it's own set of rules that doesn't take into account any notions of good or bad beyond achieving their objective...thier characters are one of the true delights of the show for me. In fact I was a bit dissapointed when Ben seemed to take the killing of his daughter personally.

I want to know who eloise is.


My own question and complaint...if they don't get Sawyer back on this show soon...I'm writing an angry letter and if he's on next week, but spends the whole episode doey eyed over that garden-tool...I may write an angry letter.[/spoiler]
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DocZaius
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Post by DocZaius »

I think I've figured it out...it's the icon that says spoiler.


[spoiler]It might not be the time travel mom. Jack's Daddy got there in a coffin too....before the time shifts.

The scene of Ben killing John shocked me...in a BOO sort of way, but not the act. One of two things, I think...Ben needed further information from John and he needed to make sure that John "died," as part of the plan to get back to the island and stop the shifts. John hasn't been able to kill anybody else...would he have been able to go through with it. OR, Ben needed the information from John and he wants John dead...real dead, eliminated as a challenger...it isn't the first time he's tried to kill him.

It's the second. I don't think Ben knew he needed John to go back to the island as a corpse. Ben clearly looked surprised when John told him about Eloise Hawking. I don't think Ben knew specifically how to get back. Ben wanted his rival dead; it's that simple.

Also, John has killed recently. He killed at least one of the Others who were about to chop off Juliet's hand. He wasn't up to killing his own father, though he was perfectly fine with letting Sawyer do it.

I think the personal war that's being waged between Widmore and Ben has it's own set of rules that doesn't take into account any notions of good or bad beyond achieving their objective...thier characters are one of the true delights of the show for me. In fact I was a bit dissapointed when Ben seemed to take the killing of his daughter personally.

I want to know who eloise is.

She's probably an Other from the 1950s. She's also Daniel Faraday's mother. The real questions are: (a) how does she know so much about time travel and the island and (b) who is she aligned with? I think it's pretty clear that she's no fan of Ben (and Ben didn't seem to know who she was when John told him her name). But I don't think she's aligned with Widmore, either.


My own question and complaint...if they don't get Sawyer back on this show soon...I'm writing an angry letter and if he's on next week, but spends the whole episode doey eyed over that garden-tool...I may write an angry letter.

No worries. The preview looks like next week will by Sawyer-riffic! Maybe he'll even run around shirtless for you.
[/spoiler]
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efbart
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Post by efbart »

[spoiler]Yeah...I guess it was Alpert that told John he had to die. I forgot about him killng that lady from the frieghter...she's the only one though. Rember the story from his commune days when he couldn't kill the informant and there's been other times on the island where he's had one excuse or the other...but, he did take that lady down with hesitation.

That's what I mean about who is eloise...what's her relationship to all this.


HE can run around naked as long he's cracking jokes and not whining about Kate. ;D[/spoiler]
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DocZaius
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by DocZaius »

^^ Yeah, I don't like whiny pathetic Sawyer one bit. I want bitter sarcastic nicknaming Sawyer back.
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efbart
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Post by efbart »

[spoiler]Did John tell him lastnight that he had to get everybody back to the island. Have we been shown how ben became aware of the plan? When he goes to Jack he has a time limit...given to him by eloise. She may not like him but she's using him...allowing him to go back to the island. Yet, she's obviously got a connection to Widmore. Does ben not know that Widmore is the one who gave John the name?[/spoiler]
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DocZaius
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LOST - February 25, 2009 - "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham"

Post by DocZaius »

[spoiler]Did John tell him lastnight that he had to get everybody back to the island. Have we been shown how ben became aware of the plan? When he goes to Jack he has a time limit...given to him by eloise. She may not like him but she's using him...allowing him to go back to the island. Yet, she's obviously got a connection to Widmore. Does ben not know that Widmore is the one who gave John the name?[/spoiler]
[spoiler]Widmore didn't give John the name. Christian Shepherd did.

I don't know how Ben became aware of the plan to bring everyone back, but from the previous episodes, Eloise Hawking clearly believes that everyone has to go back. We haven't seen Ben's first encounter with Hawking, but I bet she told him.[/spoiler]
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efbart
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Post by efbart »

[spoiler]Yeah...that's right.

Widmore does know who she is though...he sent Desmond to her. So, there's Farriday, C. Shepard, Claire...I guess...that are involved, but it's not clear to me at least...what their role in this business between ben and widmore is....nevermind Richard or Jacob.[/spoiler]
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G8rMom7
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Post by G8rMom7 »

Well, I clearly LOVE Sawyer for an entirely different reason than you boys! :wink:...he gives me the tinglies! :) But I LOVE the names he makes up...he just recently called Charlotte "Ginger" and it was obvious to me it was from Gilligan's Island, but I think someone else here thought it was a reference to something else. I don't remember.

As for the other stuff...

[spoiler]I think the writers just love for us to wonder who is good and who is evil and I believe it will come to pass that no one is either...it is the "philosophy" these days that there is no such thing as good and evil and that everyone just exisits. Doesn't make for good drama though.[/spoiler]
Okay, let's try this!

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radbag
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Post by radbag »

best thread ever.


i don't agree with the 'filler' feeling...i was on a roller coaster of emotion just now:

[spoiler]i don't trust ben OR widmore...widmore kind of came off as reliable but then matthew was brought in to help john and i don't trust that matthew dude...widmore is guilty by association imo...and so i started looking at ben in a better light...then ben lied when he told locke that whatever he told jack, it worked...he even lied about saying jack bought a round-trip ticket...we ALL knew that was a lie right? i expected foul play shortly thereafter as a result...then i became suspicious of ben and HIS motives...so there leaves absolutely nobody for me to trust...OTHER THAN JOHN that is...lol [/spoiler]

btw - welcome to the club effie!
radbag
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Post by radbag »

Well, I clearly LOVE Sawyer for an entirely different reason than you boys! :wink:...he gives me the tinglies! :) But I LOVE the names he makes up...he just recently called Charlotte "Ginger" and it was obvious to me it was from Gilligan's Island, but I think someone else here thought it was a reference to something else. I don't remember.

As for the other stuff...

[spoiler]I think the writers just love for us to wonder who is good and who is evil and I believe it will come to pass that no one is either...it is the "philosophy" these days that there is no such thing as good and evil and that everyone just exisits. Doesn't make for good drama though.[/spoiler]
me, me, me!!! i was the one who said ginger was in reference to being a red head as opposed to a gilligans island reference...WHICH GIVES THOUGHT TO THIS

[spoiler] what came first? calling someone 'ginger' because of gilligans island or calling someone 'ginger' because they've got red hair. here's the thing:

i know of many of londoners and brits who've called redheads 'ginger' and it was based on a cartoon they had watched way before the days of gilligan's island...did 'ginger' orignate from the cartoon, gilligans island, or the popular british nickname for redheads...time travel????? lol [/spoiler]
G8rMom7
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Post by G8rMom7 »

Great...let's get me confused about non-Lost show things now! LOL

[spoiler]Considering it was Sawyer who called her Ginger I am confident he was referring to Gilligan's Island...I just don't see Sawyer being sophisticated enough to be referring to and English slang term for it. [/spoiler]

The funny thing is rad...I was thinking it was Bill and I who were discussing that whole thing and then I remembered that Bill doesn't watch Lost...that happens to me a lot...I have a discussion with one of the fine BA men and think that I was talking to my husband. Weird.
Okay, let's try this!

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DocZaius
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Post by DocZaius »

[spoiler]then ben lied when he told locke that whatever he told jack, it worked...he even lied about saying jack bought a round-trip ticket...we ALL knew that was a lie right?[/spoiler]
[spoiler]No, I didn't think that was a lie. Remember when Jack was flying around on his "golden ticket," trying to get back to the island? I think that's what Ben was referring to.[/spoiler]
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G8rMom7
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Post by G8rMom7 »

^^^Yes, I was thinking that same thing Doc.
Okay, let's try this!

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