where is the line? re: gundy tirade

[radbag]

One of the hottest topics in college football this week is about an off-the-field incident that concerns Oklahoma State coach Mike Gundy, Oklahoman columnist Jenni Carlson, how coaches should deal with personal affronts on players by the media and if there is a line drawn for writers when dealing with such issues.

The story stems from a column written by Carlson, who had outlined reasons why Oklahoma State quarterback Bobby Reid might have been benched in favor of Zac Robinson. Reid's attitude was one cause, Carlson contended.

Gundy took offense to the column – calling it 75 percent inaccurate, although Carlson has contested that claim – and used his entire post-game news conference after the Cowboys defeated Texas Tech, 49-45, last week to berate Carlson and display the column in question.

Kansas City Star columnist Jason Whitlock, who knows Carlson, called her column a mistake. Another media outlet called Carlson and Gundy buffoons. Others have come to the support of each side. SEC coaches responded to questions about Gundy's outburst Wednesday on the media conference call. Would they have handled it the same way?

"I've had problems with some things written before," Florida coach Urban Meyer said. "I understand everybody has a job to do and I respect everyone's position. I saw parts of what happened (at Oklahoma State). I know coaches get extremely tied to their players. Attacking someone's performance, that's what we get paid to do.

"I often speak to our players about being professional and understanding everyone has a job to do. Especially at the high-profile places, you just have to learn to deal with it. You're going to get it from fans as well. Try walking off a bus one time at an opposing stadium. You have to be very professional and keep your eye on the target."

The issue for many SEC coaches does not seem to be attacking player performance as much as manhood, maturity or off-the-field circumstances. Fairly criticize poor play. That's fine. But also realize some of these players are still teenagers. Even older players are still young adults and the media might not understand the effect criticism can have on a player, especially about off-the-field matters.

"Frankly, these are college students," LSU coach Les Miles said. "Frankly, the press needs to realize these are guys who are trying like heck to get their degree. Some do and some don't have all the answers. Some guys have the ability and can play comfortably and some guys struggle like heck to get on the field. There are times where there needs to be some recognition these are student-athletes and not necessarily professional players. When you're on the outside looking in you don't really know."

South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier doesn't mind the criticism – as long as it's based in fact. Criticize play-calling, criticize players, criticize what you like, Spurrier said, as long as it's your opinion and it's factual. If a reporter's opinion is consistently wrong, he or she will soon be out of a job, he said. But if the criticism is on point, the coach and his team might be the ones with problems.

"Somebody said if you don't read the newspaper it won't bother you," Spurrier said. "The only thing that upsets me is if they write something that's just not true. If their opinion is wrong over and over and over they won't have a job anymore. If they write something that's not a fact, that's upsetting. If there was something that wasn't true in it I would think coach Gundy would say this is an absolute lie and bring it out."

Where is the line? Do columnists have carte blanche to criticize as they wish? Is it fair to criticize the personal lives of student-athletes if it might somehow affect their on-field performance? How should college athletes be treated differently than professionals? There are no easy answers. It's all up to interpretation and it is clear last week in Stillwater, Okla., the interpretations of Gundy and Carlson clashed. Will this unfortunate incident lead to a better understanding between columnists and coaches?

"You deal with those things personally," Tennessee coach Phillip Fulmer said. "You don't have to go off and have a public mess. We're dealing with young people and we're trying to lead by example. If I have an issue with a writer, I'll usually pick up the phone and call him or see him after practice.

"We deal with these young people. We see them with their helmets off as young people. We're very much the parent away from home. If it gets to be personal, that gets over the boundaries. From my standpoint, I wouldn't expect a personal attack on players. They're young people in college, not professional. They're trying to use those learning experiences they have to improve themselves and grow."

Said Alabama coach Nick Saban: "The way I've always tried to do these things is you want to try to develop relationships with people. That's the best way to solve problems, talk to them one-on-one and explain what your feelings are and the consequences of what are said and done. There are a lot of cases, I go through this sometimes, too, people don't really realize how you affect the personal side of somebody.

"Our players are young people. I'm not saying we have to protect them all the time. Everyone should have a professional attitude about how you develop relationships and how you talk. I certainly respect what you guys have to do and what you're trying to do. Sometimes we make mistakes in what we're trying to do. Sometimes people in the media make mistakes, too."

[a1bion]

Gundy looked like a goofball. If you're going to go on a rant, at least make it high quality, a la Jim Mora's screaming, "PLAYOFFS?!?!?" at the media (my personal favorite) or Denny Green's total meltdown last year.

[MinGator]

"THEY ARE WHO WE THOUGHT THEY WERE!!!!!"

LOL

[IHateUGAlyDawgs]

I'm still not sure where I come down on this one...

they are amateur athletes, but very high-profile in many instances (similar to the Olympics).

No one has a problem with criticizing olympic athletes (for instance the snow skiier from a few years ago who was a drunkard), so why should we care about criticizing college QBs?

I like the argument that criticism is fine as long as it is directed at on field performance as opposed to calling at the toughness of a player, but even I'm not entirely sold on that argument.

Just not sure where I stand really.

[G8rMom7]

I kind of wonder if that guy had/has some issues with his kids at home...like one of his kids is being picked on at school or something. He just went over the top in my opinion. Almost as if he was putting on a show for his players...one sports reporter admitted the players will probably appreciate how much he stood up for them. But Geez, what was said about their quarterback could not possibly have come close to the criticism given Chris Leak. But I think as long as they are talking about performance on the field, then college players are as fair a game as professional. Personal attacks or comments amount their situations off the field are a different story, IMO.

[IHateUGAlyDawgs]

Gundy's tirade pales in comparison to this one...

very NSFW Audio...

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[RickySlade]

But I think as long as they are talking about performance on the field, then college players are as fair a game as professional. Personal attacks or comments amount their situations off the field are a different story, IMO.

Have you read the article?

By Jenni Carlson
The Oklahoman
STILLWATER ? Bobby Reid stood near the team charters last Friday night, using his cell phone, eating his boxed meal.

It would've been normal post-game activity but for one thing.

His mother was feeding him chicken.

Which brings us to the quarterback switch-a-roo at Oklahoma State.

Don't see the connection?

Let me explain. Cowboy coaches have gone full-speed ahead with the Zac Attack, opting to start Robinson over Reid a week ago, then sticking with him against Texas Tech today even after an embarrassing loss at Troy. Weren't we being told just last week that Reid was still the guy? All the weight with which Cowboy coaches were backing Reid has totally shifted to Robinson.

The change seems sudden.

Thing is, it may not be as abrupt as it looks. If you believe the rumors and the rumblings, Reid has been pushing coaches that way for quite some time.

Tile up the back stories told on the sly over the past few years, and you see a pattern that hasn't always been pretty.

Word is that Reid has considered transferring a couple different times, the first as early as 2005. Reid, then a redshirt freshman, was facing competition from returner Donovan Woods, and apparently, Reid considered leaving OSU just because he had to compete for the spot.

Reid's nerves have also been an issue. Earlier this year, he told our Andrea Cohen about his game-day emotions.

"I get sweaty palms. I get the butterflies in my stomach. I sweat lot,” he said then. "I've been playing this game for 15 years. And I can honestly say every game I've played in, I've been nervous. It's not so much me being scared; I just get to a point where I start worrying about a lot of things I can't control.”

A lot of guys get nervous, some even puke before games. How you handle the nerves is important, though, and Reid hasn't always managed them well. He has gotten off to some extremely slow starts, putting the Cowboys in some holes. Some, they dug out of, with Reid often wielding the biggest shovel, and some, they couldn't.

Then, there have been the injuries. No doubt some of Reid's ailments have been severe, including an injured shoulder that required surgery and forced him to redshirt. Other times, though, Reid has been nicked in games and sat it out instead of gutting it out.

Injuries are tricky, of course. You don't want a guy to put himself in harm's way if he's really hurt, and yet, football is one of those sports in which everyone plays hurt. Aches and pains, bumps and bruises are part of the gig.

Reid's injury against Florida Atlantic ? whatever it was ? appeared minor but just might have been the thing that pushed Cowboy coaches over the edge. Even though Mike Gundy said last week that Robinson got the nod because he had the better week of practice, insiders say that the coaches decided to bench Reid early in the week. The bottom line: The switch is less about Robinson's play and more about Reid's attitude.

"The coaches made a decision,” Reid told our Mike Baldwin after the Troy game. "I just have to go with it, get better and get back on the field.”

There's something to be said for not being a malcontent, but you can almost see Reid shrugging his shoulders as he says those words. Does he have the fire in his belly?

Or does he want to be coddled, babied, perhaps even fed chicken?

That scene in the parking lot last week had no bearing on the Cowboys changing quarterbacks, and yet, it said so much about Reid. A 21-year-old letting his mother feed him in public? Most college kids, much less college football players, would just as soon be seen running naked across campus.

And what of the scene television cameras captured earlier that evening of Reid on the sidelines laughing with assistant strength coach Trumain Carroll? The same cameras showed him throwing his cap in disgust after a missed play earlier, but to be laughing in the final minutes of an embarrassing loss is bad form.

Reid is the most talented quarterback in Payne County, but he hasn't proven that he's the toughest. If you listen to the rumblings and the rumors, Cowboy coaches simply grew weary of it.

Who knows? There might come a day when they grow tired of something Robinson does, but for now, they appear willing to sacrifice a bit of talent for a lot of grit.

She got off easy...

[G8rMom7]

Yeah, I can see now why he got upset. However, like Spurrier said, if she is giving a WRONG opinion a lot of the time, she won't have a job for long. I still think the guy looked ridiculous acting like that...I'm not sure if it helped his cause although like I said, it may have helped his image with his players which might have been something he needed to do.

One thing some of you younger guys might not remember is Gator haters used to always crack on our players, our fans, etc. But when Spurrier became our coach he took a lot of that hate on himself and would deflect a lot that used to directed at the players. That is one thing I was always impressed with about him.

[radbag]

reporters - apart from reporting the news - are in business of selling papers/columns etc and creating a following, a buzz and/or a stir.

i think she was successful in that regard.

[G8rMom7]

Ihate...I just listened to that thing you posted...wow. He surely did rag on the few people that are able to go to the games during the week! Bascially called them all unemployed losers! What about all those people who work but don't work a normal schedule and are able to go to the games. I would be offended if I were a Cub fan to listen to that!

[IHateUGAlyDawgs]

he was fired four months later, m7.

[Toothy]

I am a Cubs fan, M7. And Lee Elia is the greatest manager in baseball history. That speech is right up there with Hamlet for me.

[IHateUGAlyDawgs]

that speech was 11 days after I was born