Rad, Growl stickied his apology

G8rMom7 · Post by **G8rMom7** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:28 am

Wow PMC...you really did a good job with your boy...he is just like you!!!

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:32 am

I agree with what you said about Darth. That guy's a piece of shit and something should be done about that.
concur...but how are you going to do that without looking like you're just trying to keep the pot stirred at this point?

we have had serious compromises in what we thought was a secure, private place...obviously, the intrawebs are open for game so we can't truly have private space but C'MON!!!!! an ADMIN for christs sake? abuse of power, abuse of privilege, abuse of trust, violation of our privacy....wtf?!

we are owed an explanation as to why that went on.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:33 am

And just to echo a point Manny already made, the friendships we've made here really are the most important thing and have been pretty amazing throughout all of this and even before. Like rad, I was a little hurt when I got booted out of there. But when it came down to it, you guys were the ones I was interested in talking to over there anyways so I didn't lose what was important to me about that place in the first place. And we've kept on keeping on since then, doing our thing and having all kinds of fun together the whole time.

Without this place, we'd never have been able to put together all of our shenanigans, be it posting about our families and lives to organizing the response to the original raid to trying to figure out how drunk annarbor was the night before when he started one of his trademark 3 am threads. You guys are the best.

[img]{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_grouphug.gif[/img]

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:39 am

I agree with hater but honestly, if you expect more from him...like specifically spelling out what he did, you should tell him so. However, I don't think it's quite realistic to expect him to admit to all he has done wrong...I mean it IS rather embarrassing and no one would like to tell a message board full of strangers how low you will really go just because you don't have anything better to do.

I think to just get things back to normal you should just give a nod to his apology, post over there every once in a while and get him to apologize to a1 too. I agree that Darth needs to be called out, but he's got a lot of people hooked on his crack (porn) so you may not get much support for that. Of course you will get support from us, but you know what I mean.

I was not really surprised by Growl's apology...well, mainly because I read it yesterday. But I would have been surprised if he had gone ahead and said exactly what he did in regards to letting the BPers loose this past spring, and the venom spewed at Matt...all in the name of post counts. If he had admitted to that, I think that would have really been something.

As it is, it's up to you. I think I've made peace with the few over there I care about. I do disagree with you about the goody two-shoes vs. the pervs...I think when we're talking numbers, there are more pervs over there wishing for more NSFW and less "what's for dinner?". [img]{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif[/img]

some things need to be said in order for healing (on BOTH ends) to occur...the pubbers need to know from THEIR exalted one that we were innocent in the raid...in fact, we defended...we stood up for matt....we called out the parties responsible (darth/solari), and we got banned for it...pub needs to know that we were not appreciated and the truth was kept from all...

thanks for your support throughout and appreciate you being such a great conduit of information and more importantly, a great and loyal friend all the while.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:45 am

VICTORY!

[william wallace]Before we let you leave, your commander must cross that field, present himself before this army, put his head between his legs, and kiss his own arse.[/william wallace]

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:51 am

I am the new guy, so I don't have a dog in the fight. I will give you a few thoughts though since you have asked for them.

A leopard can't change his spots. People do not change, the person they once were is the person they will always be. No matter how much they/we might want to change or how much they want us to change, it just doesn't happen. Might put on a good show for a while, but they will not change. Long story short, if they fucked you once they will fuck you again.

They seem to want you more than you want them. You have to ask yourself why. My guess would be hits and traffic. This site has a limited number of users and look at the number of posts on the front screen. That does not include the actual registered hits when people come and read the threads but do not post. Ray wants them back in a bad way, I promise you. He is a business man and wants what can make him money. The more hits and posts on his site the more advertising dollars he can milk from people. That to me means that you are holding the cards so you might as well make them give into whatever demands you have upfront, which leads me to my next point....

I have a feeling you had a hand in baka becoming an admin over there. You wanted someone nuetral and he appears out of the blue the day you get your apology. I wonder if there wasn't some back door communication going on. Which is cool to me, like I said, I don't have a Dog in the fight so it matters not to me. Just an observation. I think if you want to post over there that you should get some Mods of your choosing to help or another admin to offset "their" guy. Remember this, baka may be a good guy, don't know him, but Ray and Growl gave him the position and no matter how many apologies they issue, you were still the enemy for many many months and baka knows that. He might not ever admit that, but he knows that. What's to say this isn't a setup for down the road.

With all of that said, I enjoy the posting over here but if you boys and girls wanna shut this bitch down and start posting back over there then I am in for whatever you decide. I posted with those people but enjoy you guys more in the short time I have been here.

agree on your points that the leopard spots do not change and i will act accordingly...i don't expect anything like it was in the past, i expect nothing really.

as far as baka, he could't match up to any of us...he's probably a nice guy and it's not my intention, nor should it be, to fuck with him on the get go...he'll be better served if he welcomes us all as opposed to incite us...from what i've seen thus far, he's been middle of the road and he's not been sword wieldy if you know what i mean....tbl/shane always liked to wave their sword around...pissed me off.

and as for shutting this bitch down, you have better chances winning the florida lottery...i wouldn't bet on it yo!

btw - your involvement the last several weeks has been immense and invaluable...I don't know you THAT well but my personal thanks goes out to you for your support despite your lack of history and perspective in this.

thanks.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:55 am

[quote]milk it, let's see what else you can get :lol:

IHateUGAlyDawgs · Post by **IHateUGAlyDawgs** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:03 am

I agree with what you said about Darth. That guy's a piece of shit and something should be done about that.
concur...but how are you going to do that without looking like you're just trying to keep the pot stirred at this point?

we have had serious compromises in what we thought was a secure, private place...obviously, the intrawebs are open for game so we can't truly have private space but C'MON!!!!! an ADMIN for christs sake? abuse of power, abuse of privilege, abuse of trust, violation of our privacy....wtf?!

we are owed an explanation as to why that went on.

Let me make this clear. I am NOT defending darth by any means. But this is something I think you need to hit them with in a couple days - not right now.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:07 am

As is well known, I post on GC and was honored to be invited here. Speaking as a BA person, I'm really happy for you rad, that Growl admitted to wrong doing ( etc.-etc) and publicly apologized. Speaking as a person on GC that misses "radbag," and after reading the apology, I would be waiting anxiously for a response from said radbag. I am trying to say, that if I was just a regular poster in the Pub that knew rad, and wanted him back, I would be very disappointed if there wasn't a response to the apology from him.

I think an acceptance of the apology with a "let's move forward" attitude could go a very long way in healing many of the wounds in the Pub, and maybe the Pub could be returned to the fun playground where you (we) all met each other and formed friendships in the first place.

It's late, and maybe you have already made a statement rad. I'm going over there soon to read the threads.

Of course, rad, I am respectful of the fact that you are free to handle this in a way that is best for YOU. I do want that for you!

Love ya....

ahhh ... the lovely pam....how sad it was for me when i got banned and i was no longer able to communicate freely with you...you are such a great friend and valuable source of honesty, sensibility, and reason. thanks for your support of me and your friendship throughout...you sticking by me made me feel real good about all that time spent there....again, thanks!

i respect you IMMENSELY and value your position on all things...i've read your post and understand your message. i am grateful for your time and input on all this.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:14 am

rad, if I were you I would at least make a courtesy acknowledgement of the apology soon...you can always go into detail with it later, jmho.

in due time hater...i'm looking to hook up with growl on an IM this evening...will need to have my IP address unbanned as well...

not to beleaguer this point and not to de-emphasize everyones effort in aiding me to obtain that apology from them, i'd like to say (because i don't believe i have to this point) that you hater have stuck your neck out time and time again - grilling them mercilessly, unwavering and with the same vem and vigor since day one...to THAT i owe a tremendous bit of indebtedness and gratefulness...for without you, i believe this all would never have happened the way it did. thanks for defending our cause and thanks for being so effective.

G8rMom7 · Post by **G8rMom7** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:16 am

Random hijack...I just realized we need to have a Q and A thread for TT...thoughts? It would be a good way to get to know him better and those were kinda fun right?

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:18 am

Rad, shake hands and show you are the bigger man. I will write more, but I am tired. You know that took a lot for GG to write that, yep it might be a pony show, but he didn't just email it to you, he posted it.

your fans want you, don't let them wait.

my sponsor...what can i say about my sponsor. (you're the one that left me to my own devices to begin with! [img]{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_evil.gif[/img] )

for those that don't know, tek has always, and i mean ALWAYS been in my corner...no matter how fucked up i ever was, no matter how hard headed, no matter how WRONG...she has ALWAYS supported me and kept me in her camp...if it wasn't for tek, i'd have been banned a LONG, LONG time ago...maybe even to the point where i would not have met any of you...to that i am most thankful for and will always consider you my guide and mentor.

i understand your directive and will make right by it.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:22 am

Alright, rad, here's my thoughts:

You've "won". He has conceded the whole thing to you. Not asking any concessions in return. He has made the effort that you always said was required of him. You don't have to be friends with him, and I would be shocked if you could based on past history - but apologies can go a long way to healing wounds.

If I were you I would go in there and accept the apology. Post every so often if you desire. I don't intend to make a permanent home there as I have one here, but I will still visit there on occasion as I think you should/will. I know you want to at least a little bit or you wouldn't have fought this ordeal so long.

The apology you wanted has been made. At least show up in the thread to accept it. That's MHO.

Exactly....couldn't have said it better.

one of the things about goner that everyone should know (not only for TTs benefit) is that geo is a man of little words...but when he posts, people listen..and they should...words are not wasted, words are not minced...the words are effective and he's always done a great job of that...appreciate your reinforcement all those times...you and mommy were rock steady and a stabilizing force throughout...thanks.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:27 am

now on to the more serious aspect of this thread.

i agree with those above, apology extended and should be accepted before too long. make a short appearance, but leave them wanting more.

most of the drama went beyond my available hours to keep up with but i agree that people will not change in the long run. that being said i think we all know there must be reasons that this is happening now. why bother to fix it now? i think the pub is in the crapper and the majority of the posters are uninspiring (as if i am one to talk). the pub imo is headed into being a ghost town with little draw for anyone interested in meaningful banter.

darth is still an issue but with the BA it's almost a non-factor since i feel i can post freely here and have no need to at GC. he still needs a good slice of humble pie but i think it's best to wait a while and hit him when he doesn't see it coming.

I'm thankful that we have the BA that provides me an outlet in my day with good folks. honestly i used to never get the "i met them on the internet" thing. always thought it was weird, but having been here i get it. there are good people that you can get to know no matter the method of communication.

i'm thankful as well as you are that we have this setup for ourselves...the BA has made us stronger and better friends...what i really like about the BA is that we have all walks of life here...the different perspectives are healthy and necessary for all of us...but as we differ on opinions/topics, we surely respect each others views and THAT is refreshing and a major plus about the BA...

i've enjoyed your camaraderie all this while and thank you too for all your insights and supportive thought throughout...thanks.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:29 am

I did not think of the advertising revenue issue. That could be a very valid reason for keeping the Pub hoppin'. They do sell that advertising based on the estimated amount of views/clicks the ads tend to get. If no one is going over there, what advertiser would give them money to have their ad on there?

But being that I work in Marketing, I think that is a good reason for Growl...I don't see it at sinister or anything. They DO need to keep the Pub hoppin' if they are making money on teh ads. That's business. Of course, it would be nice that IF that were the case, if he admitted to it. I dont' think it makes him any less sincere, but it would explain the "why now" factor.

quite possibly but seriously none of my business as it is not my intention to make it what it once was...

maybe if they pay us all or at the very least, give us comp subcriptions, perhaps. [img]{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif[/img]

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:33 am

When someone gives you an apology, you should accept. In this case, you have a chance to come across as the gracious winner,
instead of a sour loser. Like PMC, I don't like conflict, and I'm all about healing relationships. TT says people don't change, but I've
seen too many people change to believe that.

I think you should accept the apology publicly, and then, as far as posting over there, it's up to you and how comfortable you feel.
But if you don't accept and don't acknowledge the apology, it just makes you look petty and small in the end.

And I wrote this before I read page 2.

agreed kyle..i don't want to come off as a ungracious winner too..i will reach out at some point today once my ip addresses have been unbanned.

the last thing i want is to spoil most of your good names over there...i know THEY know some of you are associated with me so i don't want to cast your (generally speaking) names in bad lights...definitely priority one in the matter and will be in the way i conduct myself...i have several points and questions i will need answered by growl first before i am to become a 'regular poster' once again...the possibility hinges on the answers to those questions.

not accepting was never an option...thanks for the comments kyle and thanks once again for your part in helping me achieve my objective.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:34 am

I agree with what you said about Darth. That guy's a piece of shit and something should be done about that.
concur...but how are you going to do that without looking like you're just trying to keep the pot stirred at this point?

we have had serious compromises in what we thought was a secure, private place...obviously, the intrawebs are open for game so we can't truly have private space but C'MON!!!!! an ADMIN for christs sake? abuse of power, abuse of privilege, abuse of trust, violation of our privacy....wtf?!

we are owed an explanation as to why that went on.
Let me make this clear. I am NOT defending darth by any means. But this is something I think you need to hit them with in a couple days - not right now.

i think it would be appropriate to ask during this evenings IM chat should he want to. now is the time imho hater...i value your opinion but why put off what we can get done today?

IHateUGAlyDawgs · Post by **IHateUGAlyDawgs** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:36 am

if you're doing it in an IM session that's fine. I thought you were going to ask it on the boards, and I didn't think it necessary to get everyone in a fight again.

radbag · Post by **radbag** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:41 am

Random hijack...I just realized we need to have a Q and A thread for TT...thoughts? It would be a good way to get to know him better and those were kinda fun right?

start it.

TTBHG · Post by **TTBHG** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:44 am

When someone gives you an apology, you should accept. In this case, you have a chance to come across as the gracious winner,
instead of a sour loser. Like PMC, I don't like conflict, and I'm all about healing relationships. TT says people don't change, but I've
seen too many people change to believe that.

I think you should accept the apology publicly, and then, as far as posting over there, it's up to you and how comfortable you feel.
But if you don't accept and don't acknowledge the apology, it just makes you look petty and small in the end.

And I wrote this before I read page 2.

With all due respect. People do not change. I am not talking about little changes like your wife wants you to put the seat down on the toilet and over time you program yourself to do it out of instinct. I am talking about major life changing changes. If one is a dirtbag, they will always be a dirtbag. They might be able to sugarcoat it for a little while, but I firmly believe that people are what they are.

Alcoholics are always in recovery, statistics show most start drinking again after a length of time. Drug addicts generally go through many rehab attempts and still come out using drugs. Habitual liars will always lie to you. Power addicts will always want power. Overly competitive people generally have less friends because they turn people off. Addictions and core values just do not change. I know some with disagree, and maybe every once in a while it happens, but not very often. It is a fight every time a habitual liar opens his mouth to tell the truth, it is a fight every time an alcoholic walks past the beer section in the grocery store. Sometimes they win that fight but most of the time they do not.

TTBHG · Post by **TTBHG** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:01 pm

Nice reply Rad. Short and sweet.

G8RKyle · Post by **G8RKyle** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:18 pm

I added a little more to help the situation over there. Also, the natives are starting to ask about the Gator Hole.

TTBHG, baritubabone is on to you in the Hole. He figures you are in with "rad's boys" and that's how you know about the Hole. He and TBF were like, "I wish he would shut his mouth" in the Growl apology to Rad thread. They just made a couple of comments in the Hole, but I found it to be quite funny.

IHateUGAlyDawgs · Post by **IHateUGAlyDawgs** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:18 pm

concur w/ TT

annarborgator · Post by **annarborgator** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:24 pm

nice work rad.

TTBHG · Post by **TTBHG** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 4:24 pm

I added a little more to help the situation over there. Also, the natives are starting to ask about the Gator Hole.
TTBHG, baritubabone is on to you in the Hole. He figures you are in with "rad's boys" and that's how you know about the Hole. He and TBF were like, "I wish he would shut his mouth" in the Growl apology to Rad thread. They just made a couple of comments in the Hole, but I found it to be quite funny.

That matters not to me. I do not care if they are on to me. I enjoy posting here. I actually keep bringing it up on purpose just to see what is said. If it would have any other subject other than a secret forum Bill would have rebuked my post about him not being truthful.